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Paleo's avatar

The survey of Jewish registered voters, conducted by the polling firm GBAO Strategies, found that 52 percent of respondents say the word “antisemitic” describes the president very or somewhat well.

In addition, 74 percent of respondents disapprove of the job Trump is doing as president, while 26 percent approve. Close to 70 percent said the words “fascist” and “racist” describe him very or somewhat well.

https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/half-of-american-jewish-voters-believe-trump-is-antisemitic-poll-finds/

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MPC's avatar

I'm bewildered by how much of a grip the religious right has politically in Israel. It seems counterproductive to the concept of Judaism in general, at least compared to here in America.

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michaelflutist's avatar

Many of the Americans who moved to Israel and Israeli settlements on the West Bank are religious extremists.

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Ethan (KingofSpades)'s avatar

Is this a relatively recent phenomenon? Diaspora returning from the US and Europe were more pluralistic and willing to make peace. Diaspora from Russia, northern Africa, and Western Asia tended to be much less so.

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michaelflutist's avatar

No, it goes back to the 1980s at least.

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Zero Cool's avatar

On the other hand, Russian Jews who have fled Russia to escape Putin and the Kremlin’s rule may not be extremists themselves.

But naturally, feeling the U.S. is a different affair than fleeing Russia.

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michaelflutist's avatar

The former Soviet Jews tend to vote right-wing, but mainly based on security concerns. Most of them are irreligious.

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Zero Cool's avatar

Makes sense. From what I’ve read, Putin’s push over loyalty and arguing Russians don’t need change was the final straw for Russian Jews to flee to Israel.

I wouldn’t imagine any Reform or Secular Jews would have lasted long in Russia. In the U.S., it’s much easier being in this denomination of Judaism than in countries where there’s no form of democracy.

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michaelflutist's avatar

I'm very confused by your remark about secular Jews in Russia. Russian Jews are overwhelmingly secular, are they not?

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Zero Cool's avatar

What I am arguing has less to do with the denomination of Judaism and more to do with trying to understand why in this whole time Putin has been President of Russia that more Jews remained even well into the 2010’s to then finally leave? In Putin’s rule, you cannot criticize him or you get punished (imprisonment, murder, etc.). This isn’t an environment I’d imagine any Jew wanting to live in. Of course, growing up in Russia I would understand it’s where their home is.

When I say I can’t imagine Reform Jews and Secular Jews lasting in Russia, it has to do with me thinking as an American Jew and realizing some of the most liberal and non-religious types of Jews I have come to known are Reform and Secular. Perhaps Secular Jews from Russia are different but the ones I have known over the years so not like Putin.

My grandfather left the Russian Federation in the early 1900’s and was more Reform Jewish although he, his wife and my father lived in an Orthodox Jewish household for a period of time in the 1940’s. M

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michaelflutist's avatar

Yeah, being secular does not mean that you oppose authoritarianism, and keep in mind that most Soviets were atheists or at least irreligious. I also think you're incorrect that most Russian Jews have not left Russia, but many of those who have and for example went to Israel still support him.

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Zero Cool's avatar

In case it matters, I wasn’t referring to most Russian Jews leaving Russia. I was just reading a story years ago how Russian Jews were leaving the country because of Putin but I also have not looked at the current population of Jews living in the country. If there are Russian Jews who have left to Israel and still support Putin, then they are not the ones I am referring to as discussed in the article.

Thanks for the insight on Secular Judaism. Being that I have primarily met Jews in the U.S., I have to admit I ought to meet them elsewhere in the world to get a better perspective on what they believe in.

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Kildere53's avatar

14% of Israel's population are Haredi Jews (i.e. ultra-Orthodox). The only counties in America whose percentages of ultra-Orthodox Jews are even close to that are Rockland (NY) and Ocean (NJ), and those populations are a major issue in the local politics there just as they are in Israel. Plus, ultra-Orthodox Jews usually have very large families, so their population is also growing rapidly.

In addition, Israeli politics is heavily divided and factionalized anyway, so the ultra-Orthodox parties have frequently acted as kingmakers in governing coalitions, which makes it difficult for the other parties in those coalitions to actively oppose the ultra-Orthodox parties.

As a Jew who is obviously not ultra-Orthodox, I agree that much of their social policy agenda is terrible. The sad fact is that there's always going to be a faction of the religious majority that wants to impose its views on the minority. It's up to the other members of the religious majority to promote religious tolerance and oppose extremism.

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michaelflutist's avatar

Do you have the Chasidic percentage of Kings County (Brooklyn) handy? I'm curious about New York County (Manhattan), too.

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Kildere53's avatar

In Brooklyn, I believe Borough Park and neighborhoods to the east have about 100,000 Haredi Jews, and Williamsburg has about 40,000 to 50,000. There aren't too many who live in Crown Heights anymore. That's about 150,000, which is only about 6% of Brooklyn's population. But there could be more in other neighborhoods that I'm not aware of.

In Manhattan, Haredi Jews don't dominate anywhere. Haredim voted almost unanimously for Trump last year, and Harris won every precinct in Manhattan (and the only precinct that went less than 60% for her is heavily Asian, so not Haredim). So I don't think there are a particularly large number who live there - I believe the Jews in Manhattan are more Modern Orthodox, Conservative, or Reform.

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michaelflutist's avatar

My impression is that Midwood has many non-Chasidic Orthodox Jews but also many Chasidim.

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PollJunkie's avatar

And it's only going to grow, just check the birth rates of different Jewish groups by religiosity there. The gap is so huge that it isn't compensated by Jews that choose to change lifestyles after growing up. The religious right in Israel has kept on increasing unemployed childcare support since it came to power.

As they say, Demographics is destiny.

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michaelflutist's avatar

What you're saying is interesting. My understanding is that in the U.S., it _is_ compensated by people leaving Chasidic communities.

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PollJunkie's avatar

I read a research paper which had the calculations by a secular Israeli prof., I'll try to find it.

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JanusIanitos's avatar

There are at least 18% of them who think Trump is fascist but not antisemitic. I wonder how they square that circle.

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michaelflutist's avatar

Franco was fascist but not antisemitic, and several of Mussolini's top generals were not only not Jew-haters but saved the lives of thousands of Jews in southern France and in and near other Italian-occupied areas, as well as by telling Mussolini that if he handed Jews over to the Nazis, they would overthrow him. It wasn't until the Nazis occupied Italy that Italian Jews were marked for death and murdered just for being Jews, and I understand that some important early supporters of the Italian Fascist Party were Jews.

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Henrik's avatar

Yeah, the relationship of Mussolini’s Italy and its Jewish community was quite complicated. Mussolini wasn’t even particularly fond of the Nazis until the UK sanctioned him over Ethiopia; before that, he viewed Dollfuss’s Austria as more of a kindred spirit than Hitler’s Germany (Austrofascism was explicitly anti-Pan-Germanism, for starters)

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michaelflutist's avatar

That's interesting. I am not familiar with Dollfuss. Was he antisemitic?

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Henrik's avatar

He was a student of Karl Lueger to an extent, and his whole schtick was that Austria’s identity was inseparable from its Catholicism and the role of the Habsburgs as *the* Catholic dynasty, so I’d say he was at least quite adjacent to anti-Semites and their thought processes.

But a Hitler he was most certainly not - more of a Mussolini, and indeed his most direct ideological inspiration was probably Salazar’s Portugal

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ArcticStones's avatar

There is no circle square. Fascists are not necessarily antisemites; and there are plenty of antisemites who aren’t fascists.

The increasing level of antisemitism on the left does not mean leftists are becoming fascists.

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Paleo's avatar

There is no increasing level of anti-Semitism on the left. That is a canard used by the right, and others, to weaponize anti-Semitism against universities and free speech generally in this country.

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ArcticStones's avatar

Out of respect for the limits of a certain topic, I will let the discussion be with my comment. If this topic wasn’t so sensitive, I could, without any reference to university protests, provide overwhelming evidence of my claim that the level of antisemitism is increasing – also on the left.

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Zero Cool's avatar

Laura Loomer of all people isn’t happy with Trump either.

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ehstronghold's avatar

She's only unhappy with Trump taking a $400 million 747 sized bribe from Qatar.

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ArcticStones's avatar

Actually, and much to my surprise, Laura Loomer has recently also come out with a strong defense of Medicaid. Pinching my arm: I never thought I would agree with Loomer on ... anything.

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